Author: Evan Langlois (c-67-164-129-220.client.comcast.net)
Date: 03-08-2005 01:33
Ah Yes, TAO was the name.
I really don't like Java, and I can assure you, what they had planned was not a poor java, but rather what java should have been. Java normally is restricted to a language which is compiled to an interpretted virtual machine, with JIT compilers available, where the tao product is language independant, using regular compilers like GNU C, whos virtual machine code is translated at program load time (similar to a JIT compiler). One has way more flexibility and the potential for better speed than the other.
Now, using code translators, you can disassemble 68k code, translate it to coldfire by finding and translating the instructions coldfire doesn't have and reassemble it, basically on the fly, but for an embedded device, I'd say this would only run once when doing installation of the software, not every time you run the application, much like the Amiga/Tao library cache. With some added work, I'm wondering if VST plugins can be translated or something.
Back to your mention of expenses. For comparisons of the Amiga One to other modern desktop systems ... lets see here ... AmigaOne from CompuQuick is $1459. The Apple Mac mini is $499. But what do you get for these G4 based platforms?
Machine: Amiga/Mac
CPU: 933Mhz/1250Mhz
Memory: both 256MB
Graphics: both ATI Radeon
HD: 80Gb/40Gb
CDROM: both CDRW/DVD Combos
Network: Mac has 802.11g and 10/100baseT and USB2 and Firewire, DVI connector ,etc, while the Amiga is unknown other than mouse and floppy connector and I haven't used a floppy in so long I don't know where any are.
Now .. so the Amiga has about $40-$80 more of hard disk space, a much slower CPU, and fewer options overall. Cost is $1000 more than the Mac, or you could say you can get almost 3 Macs for the cost of 1 Amiga. There are cheaper Amigas, but a G3 in this day and age? Comparing a 600Mhz G3 to the same Apple (same specs for other stuff) shows a $1200 price tag for an old G3! Compared to a G4 at more than twice the speed for $499? Twice as much machine at half the price.
Now, the "most expensive bits" are really the marketting, board design, and prototyping. After that, its mostly ports (which are more difficult to solder than most surface mount parts and are much more expensive) and then the CPU and memory.
So, when it comes to desktops, the AmigaOne is going to have 1 market ... people who use an Amiga, still use their Amiga, like their Amiga, want a faster Amiga, and are willing to pay TOP DOLLAR for a new one. Hardware wise, you can probably hack OS X and Amiga OS 4 to run on the opposite machine as they are both pretty much similar designs, the Amiga based stuff just cost more. It doesn't make sense.
Now ... as for emotional quality of a purchase. I'm afraid you are right. You can't quantify that. I've seen similar situations where people buy outrageously expensive stuff and then talk about how much better it is than anything else so that they feel better about their purchase. This is where most of the MCIBTYC wars through the 80s came from, and likely most of the Linux vs MicroSoft stuff these days (my view on that is neither is faster or better - one is just free of EULAs and more open, so the difference is largely political and somewhat religious).
The same can be said for Amiga or, getting back on track, Atari, computers vs modern Mac or PCs running their native OS or Linux. I would say that in this case is not a poltical or freedom based issue but a retro-computing issue - operating from a minimalistic approach to use lesser powered hardware. The trade-off is then features for simplicity.
This brings me to another area of computing with the same trade-offs, and the same minimalistic approach. Embedded computing! This was/is the target of this thread. Not a super-Atari, but an embedded device for niche markets that leverages the simplicity of the ST line with modern computer features and interfaces in a small embedded package. The market here wouldn't be existing ST users, but a larger base of computer users that don't need or want large complex desktop machines and don't want their productivity stopped by a 4 hour adware scan under Windows that then requires a lengthy reboot or two as well. Now, existing ST users might still buy it, but thats not the main target.
If a musician can fit it in their gig-bag, so much the better.
Now, I don't know who "arrows" is but $250 for a PowerPC chip? The 500Mhz G4 with a 100Mhz bus is about $50, and I doubt the 933Mhz parts being used in most of the Amigas are much more expensive. The coldfire is only 266Mhz (133Mhz bus) but its about half that price as well (about $25), and runs 68k code (mostly) natively and much faster than a G4 would. The coldfire is also suitable for industrial applications so it can handle lots of heat before you need a big heat sink and noisy fan. Big heat sinks are bad for small thin systems, and fans are bad for audio.
And the MegArray connector? Uhmm that 300 pin connector can be gotten at a variety of places. Even Mouser carries them! $20 for a single, and $16 each for quantities of 100+. And thats assuming its the larger 0.76 um gold plating, the one with the thinner gold are $13.18 and $10.78 for quantity. $250 for a connector? You gotta be kidding right?
Besides, in an embedded system, unlike a desktop, you'd surface mount the CPU - takes up less space, very rugged and reliable, lower cost, and you aren't likely to change the CPU anyway.
So, what is a cost effective price point for an embedded device that runs Atari music apps, has built-in MIDI and 96Khz/24 bit audio in and out, 133Mhz system bus, 128MB of DDR266 memory (lots of RAM, for an ST anyway, for working with lots of video and/or audio without virtual memory), OS and basic apps in Flash, a small 20-40GB laptop hard drive, small CDRW laptop optical drive, 266Mhz V4e coldfire CPU, 800x600 touchscreen (24 bit color), 10/100 ethernet, usb 2.0, and vga connectors, maybe 802.11g built-in as well,or a CF slot to add one.
Wondering what MPEG playback is like on a 266Mhz coldfire.
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