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 Subject: RE: Smaller batches ARE that expensive
Author: Johan Klockars (as28-3-8.va.g.bonet.se)
Date:   05-19-2002 03:18

> They are not 100% compatible but then neither

They are very far from 100% compatible.

> are the 68040s and up (and probably less too).

There are few differences worth mentioning among the 680x0 processors when running user mode non-FPU code. MMU and cache stuff is another matter, but that is an OS matter.

> They will need to emulate some instructions

Among them most 8/16 bit arithmetic/logic instructions and DBcc.
That quickly amounts to lots and lots of emulated instructions for typical Atari software (which often uses 16 bit integers for speed).

Optimized assembly routines are the most likely to require lots of emulation.
As an example, I recently took a look at my VDI function dispatcher in fVDI and discovered that more than half a dozed instructions out of a little more than two dozen would require emulation on the ColdFire. For the inner loops of some of the drawing code in the monochrome device driver it's more like half of the instructions or worse that will need emulation...

> but they should be quick and native versions

Doing the actual operations is not a whole lot of work for the emulation. Figuring out what work to do is probably where the most time will be spent.

> of software should not be hard to do

That is, however, true. Especially for software written using Lattice C and gcc, where both 16 and 32 bit int is supported (with the latter the default for both, IIRC).
TurboC/PureC does not have 32 bit int at all, unfortunately, so code written using those compilers will be harder to 'port'.

Of course, if there are no sources available and the developer is not interested/available, no ColdFire-nice version will ever be done.

> (remember that MINT and many other products already have seperate Kernals for 68030, 040, etc, etc).

There's normally not a lot to gain by compiling specifically for the '030+ processors compared to generic 68000 (although it certainly is possible to speed some things up a little).
The main reason for the different kernels is supervisor mode stuff like MMU and cache handling.
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 Topics Author  Date
 so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new ido 05-16-2002 08:34 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new The Paranoid 05-16-2002 08:56 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new ido 05-16-2002 09:06 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new ido 05-16-2002 09:17 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new ido 05-16-2002 09:27 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new The Paranoid 05-16-2002 10:32 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new ido 05-16-2002 10:40 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new Yves Gablin 05-16-2002 10:47 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new ido 05-16-2002 10:58 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new PeP 05-16-2002 12:10 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new Yves Gablin 05-17-2002 10:59 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new PeP 05-16-2002 12:10 
 ATARI video Specs new Alberto 05-24-2002 15:40 
 Smaller batches ARE that expensive new PeP 05-16-2002 12:21 
 RE: Smaller batches ARE that expensive new ido 05-16-2002 16:02 
 RE: Smaller batches ARE that expensive new PeP 05-16-2002 17:19 
 RE: Smaller batches ARE that expensive new Matthias Jaap 05-17-2002 15:28 
 RE: Smaller batches ARE that expensive new Elliot 05-16-2002 17:33 
 RE: Smaller batches ARE that expensive new FatRakoon 05-16-2002 20:03 
 RE: Smaller batches ARE that expensive new Sven Karlsson 05-16-2002 21:29 
 RE: Smaller batches ARE that expensive new ido 05-17-2002 09:30 
 RE: Smaller batches ARE that expensive new Adam Klobukowski 05-17-2002 12:14 
 RE: Smaller batches ARE that expensive  Johan Klockars 05-19-2002 03:18 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new havoc 05-16-2002 19:05 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new Baldrick 05-16-2002 20:02 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new Fenix 05-16-2002 21:40 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new FatRakoon 05-16-2002 23:38 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new Fenix 05-19-2002 16:19 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new havoc 05-17-2002 00:24 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new ido 05-17-2002 09:27 
 Dude new Fenix 05-19-2002 16:13 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new FatRakoon 05-20-2002 19:50 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new havoc 05-20-2002 21:27 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new PeP 05-21-2002 12:28 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new The Paranoid 05-17-2002 10:29 
 Grow up guys new PeP 05-17-2002 11:52 
 RE: Grow up guys new PeP 05-17-2002 12:45 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new Elliot 05-17-2002 12:20 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new Fenix 05-19-2002 16:24 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new Joe V 05-20-2002 10:56 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new ido 05-17-2002 14:46 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new ido 05-17-2002 14:47 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new havoc 05-17-2002 15:41 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new Tepes Strange 05-18-2002 09:45 
 and to my question again: new ido 05-19-2002 14:33 
 RE: and to my question again: new havoc 05-19-2002 15:22 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new Fenix 05-19-2002 16:30 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new Fenix 05-19-2002 16:29 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new havoc 05-20-2002 01:34 
 when you are the only left... new Norman Feske 05-20-2002 15:14 
 ATARI SCENERS WANTED!!!! new Mag/GFA 05-21-2002 01:23 
 RE: ATARI SCENERS WANTED!!!! new ido 05-21-2002 08:24 
 RE: ATARI SCENERS WANTED!!!! new havoc 05-21-2002 17:31 
 RE: ATARI SCENERS WANTED!!!! new ido 05-22-2002 12:37 
 RE: ATARI SCENERS WANTED!!!! new havoc 05-22-2002 14:07 
 THANKS A LOT! new Mag/GFA 05-22-2002 03:03 
 RE: ATARI SCENERS WANTED!!!! new Ragstaff 05-29-2002 10:01 
 RE: ATARI SCENERS WANTED!!!! new Norman Feske 05-21-2002 21:21 
 RE: ATARI SCENERS WANTED!!!! new ido 05-22-2002 12:21 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new Fenix 05-23-2002 11:53 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new havoc 05-23-2002 13:51 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new Fenix 05-19-2002 16:22 
 RE: so, what's new with the Atari (clone -wise)? new ido 05-19-2002 16:57 

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